Halloween Ends - Thoughts

I’ll keep it real. I know this will offend whoever likes the film and uses cinematography or other arguments but this is the genuine truth from purists of the franchise.

1978 literally ended with Nick Castle listed as “The Shape” in the credits. The Shape of what? Halloween 2 was brilliant in my eyes and most others. H40 gave me hope. I liked the brutality of the dweeb journalist pulling his mask out. But let’s just stop there.

What happens when the mask is pulled out? You’re talking a maximum security asylum with people chained to the ground. None of them saw it YET they ALL started to go crazy. I figured they were getting it right. That mask represents pure evil. Michael Myers was shot 6 times and got up within a minute. Even if you look at other films he’s been through fires & AR gunfire. But old age gets him? Nah.

Halloween is responsible for all of the other horror franchises we enjoy. 1978 gave room to birth characters like Jason. Do you realize in H20 he held himself up with one arm and lowered into the home?

Summary: YOU CANNOT KILL EVIL. Ends was a fucking terrible film which was awfully written and was the easy way out. Who the fuck cares about Corey? If you go by biblical terms (which you are doing every single time you think in terms of morals and good vs. bad) we obviously all have good and bad in us. So you fill the screen with some stalker weird looking nerd who gets revenge? Cool. Revenge of the Nerds was awesome. Halloween Ends was so bad I’d gladly watch Resurrection 20x in a row if I could erase it from existence in entirety. I mean whatever your opinion of the film; you CANNOT kill Evil. The Shape represents evil. The single scene in H40 shows you how terribly they fucked this up BAD. No creativity. "Let’s ride around with the body of a man who is NOT MY BROTHER BUT I’VE SPENT MY ENTIRE LIFE AT SHOOTING RANGES JUST TO STAB HIM TO A TABLE. Make it make sense :laughing: 0/10 genuine garbage.

I absolutely loved it.
It didn’t matter to me how Michael was portrayed, I just cared for a good movie.

I found the movie fun, surprising, and creepy in all the right ways.
Great slasher flick, I’d say maybe something like 8.2/10 is a fair score.

Totally! Walking away with that feeling is why I felt like bringing this topic back up :slight_smile:

Is it possible that the man was simply killed, but evil lived on? Perhaps there’s another Shape lurking around the corner?

No offense, but as a ‘78 purist, I believe NO sequel has justified its existence, including H2. Carpenter has frequently disowned the film. It’s garbage with the exception of the score and Pleasance’s performance.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I like Ends quite a bit, but I do have some issues with it. I wanted to know how Laurie dealt with the fact that Michael wasn’t obsessed with her. When Hawkins told her that in Kills, she didn’t react at all, so I wanted to know how she handled that revelation. It’s not mentioned at all in Ends, so I’m not even sure if she believed Hawkins.

When Corey entered Laurie’s house near the end, she should’ve been surprised that he was wearing Michael’s mask. Why didn’t she say anything about it? I would think she’d be wondering how he got it and if he knew where Michael was hiding. She should’ve been grilling him about the mask. Instead she just kind of bullies him and tells him he’s stupid for thinking Allyson would want to be with him.

The entire climax is pretty strange. Laurie puts some food in the microwave in order to distract Michael, but she doesn’t even get a knife to defend herself. When the fight is over, neither she nor Allyson discuss the fact that both Corey and Michael showed up at their house at the same time and tried to kill Laurie. Did Laurie think Michael wanted revenge or did she understand it was basically a coincidence and he just wanted his mask back? The fight seemed awfully personal for Michael, so maybe he did want revenge. I wanted some insight into what Laurie and Allyson thought was going on between Corey and Michael.

If the climax had been handled better I would’ve enjoyed the film much more, but as it stands I still like it a lot. It’s kind of disappointing as the end of the trilogy, but I wasn’t a fan of Kills and on its own Ends is pretty entertaining.

I will add another thought, even though I already replied to the discussion.
I pretty much stand with you on this, I really did enjoy Ends, like a lot.

My biggest gripe also has to do with the climax. I felt it was just… super fan service/pandering that we even got another Michael vs Laurie fight.
I thought it would’ve been so cool to see a climax that was more along the lines of Allyson vs Corey. Like it was her turn to have to run/survive a maniacal monster. Maybe even have Laurie come to save the day, similar to how Loomis did in the OG. While Allyson fought Michael at some points, she always had help. It would’ve been cool to see her “grow up” and stand up to the evil “alone” as a final test/send-off for that new character introduced in the DGG trilogy.

Also, with the epic fight from Halloween 2018, I didn’t need to see Laurie fight Michael again. You brought up another good point - Laurie has the revelation that she wasn’t Michael’s obsession. Another reason that ANOTHER final fight wasn’t needed between the two.

I kind of imagined the ending being similar to the original Halloween—of course, just amped up with new ideas/twists/surprises like a modern cat-and-mouse chase scene. Michael and Laurie fighting again… was just kind of comical, given their ages. I felt they could’ve done a lot more with Corey and Allyson at the ending, as the whole movie kinda sets it up.

Either way and in whatever way they could’ve done it, I just felt the climax could’ve been handled better.
They obviously made it a point to make Ends different from other Halloween movies, but in the end, they didn’t necessarily follow through with it and then resorted to fan service.

I did love the movie and feel very strongly that it’s a great horror flick. However, that ending just holds back the movie from being… honestly, a masterpiece. (In my own humble opinion.)

I wonder if the writers had a different idea for the climax but the studio wanted another Laurie vs. Michael showdown in order to market the film to general audiences. The trailer certainly made it seem like the film would focus on them.

Honestly, who knows what happens behind the scenes with stuff like that. It wouldn’t surprise me if that were the case, as it makes a lot of sense.

Thinking back on it, I think one of my favorite scenes was when Michael and Corey teamed up on Dr. Mathis and Nurse Deb. I wanted more of that, lol. Talking about different endings, it would’ve been awesome to see Allyson having to try and survive both Michael and Corey. Two killers against a final girl… would’ve been different and much more exciting. Oh well :sunglasses:

Yeah, I would’ve liked more scenes of Michael and Corey killing together. That was such a weird but interesting dynamic.

As a horror film is good. As a Michael Myers film I can’t stand it.

No offense taken. We all have preferences. Obviously if I had to have 1 film from the entire franchise it’d be the original. I’d basically argue it invented the modern horror era and believe H2 1981 would’ve been a completely different film has F13 not painted a scene of blood. The madness that was 80’s horror oddly enough started with a film in Halloween that pushed the envelope with most screen time being used to build character relationships and extremely low-lit scenes when Michael Myers was actually in the film. It could be the beginning and end as was planned and I’d be fine with that.

Also, I believe Donald Pleasance to be a huge part of the original and basically the true star of Halloween. His portrayal of the Psychiatrist of a truly deranged individual that couldn’t function and was beyond human led to every single film after 1978. He was in enough of 1981 and 1988 that I enjoy them. In my mind H2 is the definitive end if we ever were to have one which is why I even mention it. Plus to this day nobody has created the perfect H2 mask so it gave us a lot of amazing sculpts and artists. But yeah if I had to accept a finale other than the original of evil just walking off it’d be the hospital burning and leaving it up to thr viewer. Ends is shit for all of these reasons and more. If you’re a 1978 purist then your favorite version of Michael Myers was aged as a man and died as a man with his final moments having some weird kid in the spotlight. You can make arguments for other films in the series having high points or whatever but if it’s not perfect to kill a legend of a literal 40+ years is just stupid.

The older I get and the more movies I see, the more I’ve started to become a Halloween 1978 purist myself. That’s probably why I’d put Halloween 3 in second place, as instead of continuing a storyline that should already be over, it restarted with an original “fresh” idea.

Interestingly, I’d put Ends as my third. Yes, it’s another sequel, but unlike other movies in the series, they broke outside the “Michael Myers formula” and strived to do something original. Just like H1 and H3, Ends stands alone as its own movie with its own ideas that worked out as a great horror flick.

Writing and story aside, I think we can at least agree that Ends was beautifully shot? In terms of cinematography, sound, editing, etc., it captures the “dreamy Halloween” setting wonderfully. I would say the same thing for Halloween 2, as the movie perfectly captures that essence and feel. The problem for H2, for me, however, is the writing. It’s kind of all the same stuff that happened in H1: Loomis tracking Myers, Myers stalking and killing people, Laurie running for her life. One of the only “new” factors they had to share was that Michael and Laurie were related… which personally, ruined Michael’s character for me more than anything that happened in the DGG trilogy. The ending was cool, but it’s pretty clear Michael dies at the end, like the dude literally melts. (Which is why his return in H4 is ridiculous to me, but whatever, its a fun movie. And that’s a whole other discussion, if you want to follow that certain timeline.) His death in H2 is another thing that diminishes the impact of the ending of H1. While I used to adore H2, I just feel H1 is better off without it now.

Going back to Ends, yes, Michael and Corey both die at the end, as well. (I wasn’t a fan of that.) However, its whole message of “Evil doesn’t die, it just changes shape” at least leaves you wondering. It’s more open-ended than H2, which, in my opinion, makes it scarier. Plus, the movie had a lot more to say/add than H2.

Ultimately, I really do prefer H1 just as it is, but if I had to pick any timeline to follow in terms of sequels, its DGG all day. Ends makes it all the worthwhile for me.

(And I’m not trying to debate, fight, or anything like that. Just adding to the discussion with my 2 cents.)

See you’ve summed the film up in a way that at least makes me understand your perspective. I try to not to be bias but went in with expectations which was a horrid mistake. I will admit the cinematography was great. It wasn’t a hard film to watch for likely 75% of people who watched it. Even if they had bias it was shot well with atmospheric intrigue and once the homeless cave area is unveiled the cinephile in all of us was wondering. I fall into the true purist group as I look at Michael Myers not as a man but pure evil incarnate.

The way there is never understanding of why, and the way Donald Pleasance played the Psychiatrist just made for the true feeling of evil. It’s odd because I ask myself does that mean The Shape is Satan? And basically yes. He is the symbol of pure unadulterated and unapologetic evil.

We have members here who have visited the infamous house and scenes. On top of that, it’d be hard to find a good setup that doesn’t either have a tiny can of Dr Pepper or Coca-Cola. The mask is so important even though it’s barely seen because of what it represents. And people with 1978 still collect replicas of the truck he steals (where he gets the entire look really - the coveralls make the character more bizarre) as well as some Red Rabbit matches. I just dont see there being anything prophetic in Ends that will be talked about in 40 years you know?

That is just my take on a film admittedly I only have warched once due to the ending. Also, I never saw H2 1981 as definitive. I guess the realization he had 6 bullets and likely would bleed out if he was anybody else gave me the final realization that he represents evil and is not a man. At least not fully. I always figured he became part of the fire, it represented actual Hell, or he escaped as Michael Myers.

But there is a completely different conversation to be had off of something you said. “Evil doesn’t die, it just changes shape” see that I can get behind. But the fact that he is aggressively killing people in H40 once he breaks out and I mean even the bus scene in the series shows he has superhuman strength. Like there are teeth sold as props from H40. He lifts people by their throat like it’s nothing.

We do see that he has physically aged, but the more aggressive approach of H40 gave me hope. I’m not sure how Laurie stays exactly the same but Michael Myers is just an old man that needs to feed off of dead homeless? I hope you can see why hacing my viewpoint makes that seem so ridiculous. And just so you know I’m not being condescending I’ve always been against the Thorn Trilogy. H4 just had more of Donald Pleasance truly selling the viewer on the idea his patient is more than a man. The whole thing seemed counterintuitive as a whole though.

Definitely agree to disagree on the film (I just don’t believe it was necessary to have anything “End”) but Evil doesn’t die, it just changes shape is one of the realest things I’ve ever heard. It’s just so frustrating to me that when the idea is developed, Corey is taken out in a scene with no buildup and is tossed aside like a side character while Michael Myers (the useless old man who passes evil on to Corey who is dead from a gunshot wound in Laurie’s house?) gets mote screentime than basically the rest of the film as a dead dude on top of a car that then gets tossed into a shredder? It confused me but if I hasn’t been obsessed with 1978 I would be able to look at it without a skewed perspective. But i like your quote and feel for younger audiences 100% this movie did well and those more open-minded who enjoyed RZH2. Basically anybody more open-minded to possibilities I can understand now 100% why the film is liked so I thank you for your reply man and understand based on that quote alone how the movie can be viewed by others