WARNING: Halloween Ends SPOILER Thread: ENTER AT YOUR OWN RISK

[Shape57]

Yikes, recently heard that one of the test audiences had a standing ovation at the ending and remembered that something similar happened for Halloween H:20 so I came here to see if there were any spoilers and if what was posted is what they are going with, that’s a damn shame but I’m not surprised. I mean H:40 was essentially an H:20 re-tread, with some Rob Zombie style violence and alternate concepts and Kills carried that on (but had more RZ style odd concepts and un-disciplined scripting and less of the H:20 stuff), but Ends (if this is accurate) seems to be going further into the H:20 aspects with some RZH2 style “Is this really a Halloween movie” stuff. I don’t know why Jamie Lee would want to make the same movie again that she did 20+ years ago and just extend it over three movies.

I would not want to see more legacy Halloween films relying on classic characters (like Jamie and Rachael). I just want to see them truly go back to basics and make a simple horror film that relies on atmosphere and has enough plot and background lore to drive it but not rely on plot; the original was such a simple film (heck the first and usually best entries in all the big franchises were most often cheap, simple films), nothing after it has been like that except maybe part IV. I want to see a movie about the boogeyman, an urban legend+serial killer/spree killer/mass murderer who’s shadow still casts over a town/area where it’s a combination of the feel of a serial killer and something supernatural. When you’re reading about a long dead or long imprisoned serial killer you often feel that evil still permeating even after the killings have ended, if they happened in your town or area that name still carries a boogeyman type presence.
There was a serial killer in my town when I was a child, some of the killings took place right across from where my grandmother lived and the killer lived right there too, and oddly enough he was a pre-teen and young teen kid when he committed them (and then in the past ten years there was another murder in a park just a couple of streets away that had an unknown killer until it was recently solved, and back in the first half of the 20th century an insane asylum was housed on the park grounds, the cemetery for it with nameless grave markings still exists to this day). The name of the killer may not be on the minds of people like they once were, but when it’s brought up people get a dark feeling. It’s not like in H:40 or H:20 where the name becomes the butt of jokes and kids don’t take it seriously. It’s the same with urban or rural legends of hauntings and weird unexplained happenings and such. I feel (especially after the ending of the original Halloween) that The Shape/Michael should basically have a shadow and presence that combines that of the legend of a real serial/spree killer/mass murderer with that of an urban/rural legend of the supernatural and unexplained. None of the sequels have really dialed into this aspect like how I would want them to/how it would be most effective. Halloweens 4 and 6 have used it to an extent but didn’t really utilize things fully (I mean how did Brady never hear of Michael Myers, 6 tried a bit harder, but the Thorn and cult stuff really bogged it down); in H:20 a really weakened aspect was centered mainly around Laurie and only really as a past trauma of an event that she was in, not really caring so much about The Shape as a creepy legend; Resurrection mainly used it as a product to be consumed and the movie was too campy to take seriously; H:40 did not really take it seriously enough and saw the legend as something minor plus an H:20 Laurie re-tread, and Kills was just ridiculous and campy. No entry since the original has really tried to let the viewer’s imagination do a lot of the work.
John Carpenter has talked about (in reference to H1) that one house or place every neighborhood or town has that every kid knows about and is spooked of (the Lonnie at the Myers house at night scene really displays what Carpenter was talking about), that there are all sorts of stories about, the movie should be centered around that type of feeling, it doesn’t need some complicated plot, just continue on the legacy of what the original Halloween was based upon (which is not Laurie Strode- she just happened to be there, or the Myers family). The Shape was never meant to be a character in the traditional sense, he was like his mask- which was blank and pale with the features of a man but with hollow, black, soulless eyes). Like the cold, dark, eerie unknown, like evil, The Shape should always be there, always exist, you may divert it, you may slow it down, but you’ll never stop it. Endings like H:20 or this possible Kills ending, are just feel good character redemption moments that are the exact opposite of what I just mentioned, they are the opposite of John Carpenter’s intentions for Halloween, or in fact the endings of all of his horror films (none of which have an ending where the good guys truly win/can rest as the evil is or may still be out there, and that exists in a form in real life with the urban and rural legends that have existed for hundreds of years, we still are haunted by Jack the Ripper, Vlad Dracula still creeps people out, and then you can include stories of ghosts or hauntings from long ago events where it’s supposedly not just psychological; The Shape should be like that but in an actual entity, I just want them not to go full “oh he’s just some human” nor “oh he’s a supernatural creature like the Insidious and Conjuring series’”, you have to have it feel both real and unreal in a way where both aspects are effective.

The problem Halloween has is not keeping new legacy characters once they develop a following. They kill them all off almost immediately, so there is no cat and mouse story for the fans to follow. This is why Jamie Lee Curtis has always enjoyed a periodic paycheck from the franchise, because her character has hung around since day one. Thats also what has kept it from being completely one-note in its delivery.

Look no further than Resurrection and you understand what happens when the story is adrift after you kill off the last remaining legacy character. Once Laurie Strode was eliminated, it literally took the air out of the rest of the picture. Where are the stakes? Who cares about these new characters that will all be victims anyway? That’s the problem. And thats what will be a major challenge for the studio for a 50th anniversary chapter, because they have exhausted the Laurie Strode saga. Who would want her back in six years? The only legacy characters left untouched is Rachel and Jamie. To tell a completely foreign story with no legacy characters in it for the 50th would be a bad miscalculation.

[whitestalker78]

I hated Kills to be honest… but at the same time I can’t help but sympathize with really any of the filmmakers who aim to tackle the project.

I don’t believe Halloween to be a movie that’s really built for sequels, much less a franchise. Fans talk about the atmosphere and suspense, but those aren’t really material qualities you can simply add or subtract. By design, the suspense in the original was largely due to the “unknown”- it’s capturing the experience of being stalked by an unseen, phantasmic being. Hell- Michael being an icon goes against the entire narrative purpose he fulfills in the original. Think about it: the entire movie is structured to build Michael up as a threat- but he is not a character. There is no real sense of motivation. The story is about being stalked on Halloween by a rando. Now, to build a franchise out of that empty husk is a challenge. How do you continue the story? Is it more Kills-like random montage of murders? What new grounds does it tread, that justifies its own existence?

[Adamantium]

Fans talk about the atmosphere and suspense, but those aren’t really material qualities you can simply add or subtract.

I believe you can. It’s about how/when/where you shoot your content, how the actors act a scene, what the score sounds like, etc. If you stitch those threads together in the right way a scene can be incredibly tense and eerie. Mood and atmosphere will be there in spades.

The way H’18 and HK were made they were completely devoid of mood and atmosphere. Zero creepiness. Zero suspense. They were straight up boring and uninteresting. What a massively wasted opportunity this has all been.

JLC’s trouwma…

[Shape57]

I hated Kills to be honest… but at the same time I can’t help but sympathize with really any of the filmmakers who aim to tackle the project.

I don’t believe Halloween to be a movie that’s really built for sequels, much less a franchise. Fans talk about the atmosphere and suspense, but those aren’t really material qualities you can simply add or subtract. By design, the suspense in the original was largely due to the “unknown”- it’s capturing the experience of being stalked by an unseen, phantasmic being. Hell- Michael being an icon goes against the entire narrative purpose he fulfills in the original. Think about it: the entire movie is structured to build Michael up as a threat- but he is not a character. There is no real sense of motivation. The story is about being stalked on Halloween by a rando. Now, to build a franchise out of that empty husk is a challenge. How do you continue the story? Is it more Kills-like random montage of murders? What new grounds does it tread, that justifies its own existence?

Thats really true. Essentially the series has spent the majority of time chasing its own tail in the constant retelling of the same story on Halloween night. The only thing that really changes is the cliffhanger. And honestly does anyone think there has been enough story in this to shoot three movies? Kills by itself is really devoid of any meaningful story. Its essentially just a setup for a bunch of legacy characters to return so Myers can butcher them.

[whitestalker78]

Fans talk about the atmosphere and suspense, but those aren’t really material qualities you can simply add or subtract.

I believe you can. It’s about how/when/where you shoot your content, how the actors act a scene, what the score sounds like, etc. If you stitch those threads together in the right way a scene can be incredibly tense and eerie. Mood and atmosphere will be there in spades.

The way H’18 and HK were made they were completely devoid of mood and atmosphere. Zero creepiness. Zero suspense. They were straight up boring and uninteresting. What a massively wasted opportunity this has all been.

JLC’s trouwma…

Filmmaking and editing techniques can definitely amplify the suspense, sure. I can agree with that, to a degree- but I mean… you can throw all the tricks at the wall to see what sticks but I find that if I don’t care about the characters or the story, it just doesn’t work. Halloween did that, but it was by design more of an “in-the-moment” horror that used broad then-current teenager archetypes for a “it could happen to you” horror. The film is a masterclass in utilizing all the techniques to create suspense and terror from that- but that’s part of the challenge isn’t it? It’s been done now. Over 40 years ago and so well that its influences are still felt today. But in having the movie’s core be “this could be in your backyard” it’s also against creating characters, much less icons. Creating distinct characterizations change the horror essentially from “it could happen to anyone (aka you)” to “it happened to this person in this town”. That by itself to me lessens a big aspect of the horror. You can shake the bag of tricks up as many times as you like but without bringing something new to the table, I can’t see the story as anything more than a rehash of the “best of- highlights” sort of deal. And that is no better than Halloween Kills.

[eshoemaker]

Is this a spoilers thread or a rant on the series?

[HeCameHome383]

Some leaked info:
https://i.redd.it/1c6bwyv18se91.jpg

What was this image? It no longer links to anything

[PJ75]

Is this a spoilers thread or a rant on the series?

Good call.

[Adamantium]

I found what appears to be a more detailed overview of the leaks that were previously released:

Michael and Laurie have a smaller role than the trailers indicate; the focus is on Allyson and her new boyfriend Corey Cunningham. Michael disappeared after his rampage in 2018 and is presumed dead.

In 2019, teenage Corey accidentally killed a neighbor kid he was babysitting on Halloween night. He is declared innocent, but the entire town believes he is a psychopath like Michael and treats him like shit.

Allyson and Corey meet in therapy. Allyson is deeply traumatized and believes Michael is still alive, while Laurie has decided to move on and is now dating Deputy Hawkins and writing a book about her experiences. But Laurie is only PRETENDING to have moved on in order to bait Michael into thinking she is defenseless and unprepared.

Corey finds Michael wounded but alive in the sewers and takes him to an isolated junkyard where he works, and nurses Michael back to health. He feels he and Michael are kindred spirits due to how Haddonfield treated them.

Michael has an opportunity to kill Corey, but spares him, and seems to truly view him as an equal. Corey begins luring people to the junkyard for Michael and him to kill, starting with a police officer who frequently harasses Corey.

Allyson is convinced that Michael is behind the recent disappearances, but the police believe the culprit is a violent local hermit who believes himself to be Michael. Allyson investigates on her own and figures out Corey and Michael are responsible.

On Halloween night, Corey dresses up as Michael and goes on a rampage before targeting Laurie at her house, but she BTFOs him easily. Michael then attacks Laurie and they have a big fight. Allyson arrives to warn Laurie and ends up fighting Corey.

Laurie kills Michael by stabbing him in the face with his own knife, not only killing him but also destroying his mask.

Allyson shoots Corey and he falls off the window, but when she goes to check, he is gone. This sets up Corey and Allyson as the new Michael and Laurie.

Movie is currently testing two endings, one in which Laurie survives and one in which she dies from her injuries after killing Michael.
I mean, it sounds better than what we got in H’18 and HK. (But that’s not saying much)

[eshoemaker]

It doesn’t sound horrible, but not great either. Execution is key. If true, we will know soon enough

[ShapeShifter]

That sounds preposterous.

If possible, it sounds worse than the previous leak.

What the hell are they doing?

[boogymang]

@Adamantium

I found what appears to be a more detailed overview of the leaks that were previously released:

Michael and Laurie have a smaller role than the trailers indicate; the focus is on Allyson and her new boyfriend Corey Cunningham. Michael disappeared after his rampage in 2018 and is presumed dead.

In 2019, teenage Corey accidentally killed a neighbor kid he was babysitting on Halloween night. He is declared innocent, but the entire town believes he is a psychopath like Michael and treats him like S***.

Allyson and Corey meet in therapy. Allyson is deeply traumatized and believes Michael is still alive, while Laurie has decided to move on and is now dating Deputy Hawkins and writing a book about her experiences. But Laurie is only PRETENDING to have moved on in order to bait Michael into thinking she is defenseless and unprepared.

Corey finds Michael wounded but alive in the sewers and takes him to an isolated junkyard where he works, and nurses Michael back to health. He feels he and Michael are kindred spirits due to how Haddonfield treated them.

Michael has an opportunity to kill Corey, but spares him, and seems to truly view him as an equal. Corey begins luring people to the junkyard for Michael and him to kill, starting with a police officer who frequently harasses Corey.

Allyson is convinced that Michael is behind the recent disappearances, but the police believe the culprit is a violent local hermit who believes himself to be Michael. Allyson investigates on her own and figures out Corey and Michael are responsible.

On Halloween night, Corey dresses up as Michael and goes on a rampage before targeting Laurie at her house, but she BTFOs him easily. Michael then attacks Laurie and they have a big fight. Allyson arrives to warn Laurie and ends up fighting Corey.

Laurie kills Michael by stabbing him in the face with his own knife, not only killing him but also destroying his mask.

Allyson shoots Corey and he falls off the window, but when she goes to check, he is gone. This sets up Corey and Allyson as the new Michael and Laurie.

Movie is currently testing two endings, one in which Laurie survives and one in which she dies from her injuries after killing Michael.
I mean, it sounds better than what we got in H’18 and HK. (But that’s not saying much)

Have mixed feelings about this. Part of me likes the idea, the other thinks Michael shouldn’t be “teaming up” and/or a clone killing. Seems like a Rocky 5 type of story to me

[The_Demon_Bishop]

Michael and Laurie have a smaller role than the trailers indicate; the focus is on Allyson and her new boyfriend Corey Cunningham. Michael disappeared after his rampage in 2018 and is presumed dead.

In 2019, teenage Corey accidentally killed a neighbor kid he was babysitting on Halloween night. He is declared innocent, but the entire town believes he is a psychopath like Michael and treats him like S***.

Allyson and Corey meet in therapy. Allyson is deeply traumatized and believes Michael is still alive, while Laurie has decided to move on and is now dating Deputy Hawkins and writing a book about her experiences. But Laurie is only PRETENDING to have moved on in order to bait Michael into thinking she is defenseless and unprepared.

Corey finds Michael wounded but alive in the sewers and takes him to an isolated junkyard where he works, and nurses Michael back to health. He feels he and Michael are kindred spirits due to how Haddonfield treated them.

Michael has an opportunity to kill Corey, but spares him, and seems to truly view him as an equal. Corey begins luring people to the junkyard for Michael and him to kill, starting with a police officer who frequently harasses Corey.

Allyson is convinced that Michael is behind the recent disappearances, but the police believe the culprit is a violent local hermit who believes himself to be Michael. Allyson investigates on her own and figures out Corey and Michael are responsible.

On Halloween night, Corey dresses up as Michael and goes on a rampage before targeting Laurie at her house, but she BTFOs him easily. Michael then attacks Laurie and they have a big fight. Allyson arrives to warn Laurie and ends up fighting Corey.

Laurie kills Michael by stabbing him in the face with his own knife, not only killing him but also destroying his mask.

Allyson shoots Corey and he falls off the window, but when she goes to check, he is gone. This sets up Corey and Allyson as the new Michael and Laurie.

Movie is currently testing two endings, one in which Laurie survives and one in which she dies from her injuries after killing Michael.

[TheBoogeymanLives]

Michael and Laurie have a smaller role than the trailers indicate; the focus is on Allyson and her new boyfriend Corey Cunningham. Michael disappeared after his rampage in 2018 and is presumed dead.

In 2019, teenage Corey accidentally killed a neighbor kid he was babysitting on Halloween night. He is declared innocent, but the entire town believes he is a psychopath like Michael and treats him like S***.

Allyson and Corey meet in therapy. Allyson is deeply traumatized and believes Michael is still alive, while Laurie has decided to move on and is now dating Deputy Hawkins and writing a book about her experiences. But Laurie is only PRETENDING to have moved on in order to bait Michael into thinking she is defenseless and unprepared.

Corey finds Michael wounded but alive in the sewers and takes him to an isolated junkyard where he works, and nurses Michael back to health. He feels he and Michael are kindred spirits due to how Haddonfield treated them.

Michael has an opportunity to kill Corey, but spares him, and seems to truly view him as an equal. Corey begins luring people to the junkyard for Michael and him to kill, starting with a police officer who frequently harasses Corey.

Allyson is convinced that Michael is behind the recent disappearances, but the police believe the culprit is a violent local hermit who believes himself to be Michael. Allyson investigates on her own and figures out Corey and Michael are responsible.

On Halloween night, Corey dresses up as Michael and goes on a rampage before targeting Laurie at her house, but she BTFOs him easily. Michael then attacks Laurie and they have a big fight. Allyson arrives to warn Laurie and ends up fighting Corey.

Laurie kills Michael by stabbing him in the face with his own knife, not only killing him but also destroying his mask.

Allyson shoots Corey and he falls off the window, but when she goes to check, he is gone. This sets up Corey and Allyson as the new Michael and Laurie.

Movie is currently testing two endings, one in which Laurie survives and one in which she dies from her injuries after killing Michael.

Well that’s interesting. I like it actually accept for Michael getting killed. Hope that doesn’t happen in the other ending.

[uncle1]

so multiple gun wounds and being stabbed by a pitchfork doesn’t kill him but a stab to the face does? let me guess he gets stabbed with the mask on so the mask was helping to keep him alive because it has ~secret powers~. I guess that means if Hawkins had just shot him in the face Michael would be dead. that’s it? that’s the big secret? he just needs to have a mortal head wound to die? oh and Michael kills because it makes him ~stronger~. what is he a vampire? god I cant wait for this to come out and be done with this nightmare of a trilogy.

[ShapeShifter]

Can’t wait for Laurie’s one-liner before she delivers the killer blow. You know it’s gonna happen…

“This WAS the boogeyman!” STAB!

[Shape57]

Can’t wait for Laurie’s one-liner before she delivers the killer blow. You know it’s gonna happen…

“This WAS the boogeyman!” STAB!

“Trick or Treat Mudda-F*cka!” … LOL! Yeah I agree. It will be something stupid that says, “I am woman, hear me…roar?” Curtis is so fake.

[nike_swoosh]

If this is the case then I’m gonna have to go in with really low expectations. 2018 was a great film imo it had some problems but still my favorite after the original. Kills had good moments but was overall a bad film. From what I hear Ends is gonna be worse than kills. It might have good writing but the plot itself is a no go for a Halloween film.

[eshoemaker]

so multiple gun wounds and being stabbed by a pitchfork doesn’t kill him but a stab to the face does? let me guess he gets stabbed with the mask on so the mask was helping to keep him alive because it has ~secret powers~. I guess that means if Hawkins had just shot him in the face Michael would be dead. that’s it? that’s the big secret? he just needs to have a mortal head wound to die? oh and Michael kills because it makes him ~stronger~. what is he a vampire? god I cant wait for this to come out and be done with this nightmare of a trilogy.

How would you do it differently?

[Space_Mage]

so multiple gun wounds and being stabbed by a pitchfork doesn’t kill him but a stab to the face does? let me guess he gets stabbed with the mask on so the mask was helping to keep him alive because it has ~secret powers~. I guess that means if Hawkins had just shot him in the face Michael would be dead. that’s it? that’s the big secret? he just needs to have a mortal head wound to die? oh and Michael kills because it makes him ~stronger~. what is he a vampire? god I cant wait for this to come out and be done with this nightmare of a trilogy.

How would you do it differently?

He took 2, 44 magnum rounds to the skull and still didn’t die, if you want to really go for unrealistic, there are no exit wounds with the back of the mask, cause Loomis would have been painted with “Hint of Brain”